NoPistons -Mazda Rx7 & Rx8 Rotary Forum

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-   Single Turbo Discussion (https://www.nopistons.com/single-turbo-discussion-13/)
-   -   Rx6 Vs Gt35/40 (https://www.nopistons.com/single-turbo-discussion-13/rx6-vs-gt35-40-a-12480/)

rx7machine 05-22-2003 03:59 PM


Originally Posted by 94touring' date='May 22 2003, 01:34 PM
If you go with the gt35/40 or even a t62 (.70 compressor & 1.0 hot side) like me, you will be asking yourself "what turbo lag?".

What's the difference's between the GT35/40 and your T-62? I'm guessing the T-62 will put down more power..

94touring 05-22-2003 04:33 PM


Originally Posted by rx7machine' date='May 22 2003, 12:59 PM
What's the difference's between the GT35/40 and your T-62? I'm guessing the T-62 will put down more power..

Well I don't know all the specific details of both to give a good comparison. Both about the same size, the t62 may be a bit larger physically. The main difference is i'm non-bb which would allow the gt35/40 to spool quicker. I see 5psi @ 2700rpms, 10psi @ 3400rpms, 12psi @ 3700rpms and 15.5psi @ 4020rpms according to my datalog. A single turbo makes good enough power at 5psi to lag from light to light comforatably. I'd say normal cruising speed is 2500rpms, down shift once, hit the gas and your into 15psi quickly.

rx7machine 05-22-2003 05:47 PM


Originally Posted by 94touring' date='May 22 2003, 04:33 PM
Well I don't know all the specific details of both to give a good comparison. Both about the same size, the t62 may be a bit larger physically. The main difference is i'm non-bb which would allow the gt35/40 to spool quicker. I see 5psi @ 2700rpms, 10psi @ 3400rpms, 12psi @ 3700rpms and 15.5psi @ 4020rpms according to my datalog. A single turbo makes good enough power at 5psi to lag from light to light comforatably. I'd say normal cruising speed is 2500rpms, down shift once, hit the gas and your into 15psi quickly.

Ok, cool. I'd probably go with the GT35/40 since it's BB. I think the quicker the spooling, the better..

94touring 05-22-2003 06:22 PM


Originally Posted by rx7machine' date='May 22 2003, 02:47 PM
Ok, cool. I'd probably go with the GT35/40 since it's BB. I think the quicker the spooling, the better..

Yeah, I went the cheaper route, otherwise the gt35/40 would be on my car. Its an easy 500rpms quicker spooling than my turbo. So, it can't be too far from stock.

Rotaryman88 05-22-2003 07:23 PM

The GT35/40 is far better then a T78..I'm not going into a long discussion as I think it has been beaten to death here on this thread. The GT35/40 produces power much quicker then stock twins, t78, etc. It can hit 15psi 750RPM quicker then most others on the market. There is a newer version called the GT70R, but until it's price comes down we're not gonna make kits for it unless the buyer is willing. The only real difference on the GT70R is the compressor wheel has a more agressive cut and looks mean as hell...so far in simple testing it may even spool 200RPM quicker then the GT35/40...we'll see...

MikeL 05-22-2003 07:28 PM

Is the GT35/40 really a T3 turbine flange rather than the T4? My exhaust manifold is T4.

banzaitoyota 05-22-2003 07:41 PM

HOLY **** MIKEL has migrated to the darkside!!!!!!! https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png Welcome you are my BIOTCH!

GoRacer 05-22-2003 08:23 PM

RotaryMan88 - Can you PM me pricing on the GT70R?

...What about T04-R vs GT-35/40? These are what i've been looking at, short of the Border twins. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683473.gif

rx7machine 05-23-2003 05:32 PM

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...withstupid.gif Yea, how much is this GT70R?

kahren 05-23-2003 06:56 PM

i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

vosko 05-23-2003 06:58 PM

if you guys are worried about 750rpm you don't want a single turbo https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png

94touring 05-23-2003 09:51 PM


Originally Posted by MikeL' date='May 22 2003, 04:28 PM
Is the GT35/40 really a T3 turbine flange rather than the T4? My exhaust manifold is T4.

Yes it is a t3 flange. You can get a adapter to fit it on the t4 flange though from somewhere, don't know where though.

rx7machine 05-24-2003 01:00 PM


Originally Posted by kahren' date='May 23 2003, 06:56 PM
i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

Yea, that's the type of thing I don't want to happen if I go single turbo..

94touring 05-24-2003 04:00 PM

How low in the rpms are you guys driving your cars?

little rotor 05-24-2003 09:00 PM

Doesn't pull as well from 2k huh?

Maybe you guys need to pull out the 13B and drop in a 4 cyl diesel. Lots of torque from idle to 4k redline.

Seriously, if your just cruising then who cares how much power you have. If you want it to pull then you might want to consider dropping it a cog or two.

kahren 05-25-2003 12:17 AM

i dont always want to drop a gear or two like i do in my NA https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...closedeyes.gif

NA is more fun to beat on anyway, on the other hand anytime i want to

go slightly faster in the FD i just press the gas slightly and it MOVES

also fun, when i realyl want to go i downshift anyway.

rx7machine 05-26-2003 11:37 PM

https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...withstupid.gif yea, I agree with that..

93FDGT3540 05-29-2003 10:46 PM


Originally Posted by kahren' date='May 23 2003, 03:56 PM
i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

2k rpms? well I guess I cant argue. I guess that means you want to lug around town just above idle? Who drives thier Sports car like that anyways? I'm not 70 years old driving a crown vic. My Dyno sheet was not even a well tuned speciman and it still makes as much power as the stock twins do down low. I added a high tension wastegate spring so now it spools faster down low. Even if it made slightly less power just above idle I dont think its an important factor to gauge the performance of the turbo. If you want alot of pull down low you need a V-8 with alot of torque. Rotaries dont put down that kind of torque. Even with stock twins they dont match the abilities of a Vette lugging around in high gear without any problems. Dont trade turbos. Trade cars. You wont ever get a rotary to perform like a V-8 down low.

kahren 05-30-2003 12:02 AM

i raced a vette, from low rpms we were side by side...i have stock twins

Badog 06-04-2003 08:31 PM


Originally Posted by kahren' date='May 24 2003, 05:56 AM
i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

I have a vid somewhere of Nocab pulling me ~4 car lengths by the top of his 3rd gear. This is when I was running stock engine/turbos at 15psi and putting down over 380RWHP. He was running 15psi too. What a world of difference. Yes, he runs a GT-35/40 from Aspec.

kahren 06-04-2003 08:58 PM


Originally Posted by Badog' date='Jun 4 2003, 08:31 PM
[quote name='kahren' date='May 24 2003, 05:56 AM'] i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

I have a vid somewhere of Nocab pulling me ~4 car lengths by the top of his 3rd gear. This is when I was running stock engine/turbos at 15psi and putting down over 380RWHP. He was running 15psi too. What a world of difference. Yes, he runs a GT-35/40 from Aspec. [/quote]

that was the worst comparison ever https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/BURNOUT.gif

Rotaryman88 06-04-2003 09:03 PM

Aside from the down low argument goin on right now, not just the gt35/40..but single turbo in general reduces a lot of heat in the engine bay...and that alone is worth going to gt35/40 over the stock twins. You also free up space and make a less congested looking engine bay...there are many benefits of single over twin.

Rotaryman88 06-04-2003 09:47 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Also, can you make your stock twin setup look like this! https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/boink.gif



BLING BLING https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...1047683329.gif

rfreeman27 06-04-2003 10:32 PM

damn it i wish i had the cash!!!!



is that wastegate exhaust routed straight out? https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/wacko.png

Rotaryman88 06-05-2003 04:39 PM

On that particular kit, the WG does vent to the atmosphere....but our typical kit does dump into the downpipe...we like to try and let customers pick and choose how their kit is made..ya know, it is their cash after all https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...DIR#>/wink.png

93FDGT3540 06-05-2003 07:51 PM

BLING BLING! Oh its SOOO NICEEE!

Rotaryman88 06-05-2003 08:40 PM

93, who'd you get your kit from? JW...

Badog 06-06-2003 09:21 AM


Originally Posted by kahren' date='Jun 5 2003, 07:58 AM
[quote name='Badog' date='Jun 4 2003, 08:31 PM'] [quote name='kahren' date='May 24 2003, 05:56 AM'] i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

I have a vid somewhere of Nocab pulling me ~4 car lengths by the top of his 3rd gear. This is when I was running stock engine/turbos at 15psi and putting down over 380RWHP. He was running 15psi too. What a world of difference. Yes, he runs a GT-35/40 from Aspec. [/quote]

that was the worst comparison ever https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/BURNOUT.gif [/quote]

Then I won't tell you about the BNR ported 13B with T-78 versus the same GT35/40 then! https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

vosko 06-06-2003 10:05 AM


Originally Posted by Badog' date='Jun 6 2003, 10:21 AM
[quote name='kahren' date='Jun 5 2003, 07:58 AM'] [quote name='Badog' date='Jun 4 2003, 08:31 PM'] [quote name='kahren' date='May 24 2003, 05:56 AM'] i have been in a couple gt35/40 cars and they are nowhere close to the stock twins, go take you rcar for a drive

leave it in 3rd gear at 2k rpm and try to accelerate without downshifting, now go drive a stock car.

and dont tell me the diffrence is minor https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...R#>/tongue.png

I have a vid somewhere of Nocab pulling me ~4 car lengths by the top of his 3rd gear. This is when I was running stock engine/turbos at 15psi and putting down over 380RWHP. He was running 15psi too. What a world of difference. Yes, he runs a GT-35/40 from Aspec. [/quote]

that was the worst comparison ever https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/BURNOUT.gif [/quote]

Then I won't tell you about the BNR ported 13B with T-78 versus the same GT35/40 then! https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png [/quote]

i need to dyno again with race plugs @ 15psi... maybe we can do that when nocab comes down here for rotorfest https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

Silver Ninety Three 06-06-2003 10:41 AM

I got something for you vosko

vosko 06-06-2003 10:52 AM

but will it last the entire drive back to NJ https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

Silver Ninety Three 06-06-2003 12:44 PM

Yes it will. Also, why on earth would you be in 3rd gear at 2k rpm? If you want to accelerate, you downshift. Stock twins are nice for mildly modified cars, but once you start pushing high boost numbers, they quickly fall out of their efficency range. Mazda chose the smallest turbos that would make power at 10 psi with the best possible spool up. Go a few psi beyond that and they start generating heat. Has anyone even had a set last long running 15 psi consistantly? Also, once you start running more boost on the sequentials, you get a big spike in the powerband. This is not only dangerous, but makes the car harder to drive on the track. Hit the turbo switchover point mid-turn and it could send you off the track. What it all comes down to is what you want to do with the car and personal preferance.

kahren 06-06-2003 02:27 PM


Originally Posted by Silver Ninety Three' date='Jun 6 2003, 12:44 PM
Yes it will. Also, why on earth would you be in 3rd gear at 2k rpm? If you want to accelerate, you downshift. Stock twins are nice for mildly modified cars, but once you start pushing high boost numbers, they quickly fall out of their efficency range. Mazda chose the smallest turbos that would make power at 10 psi with the best possible spool up. Go a few psi beyond that and they start generating heat. Has anyone even had a set last long running 15 psi consistantly? Also, once you start running more boost on the sequentials, you get a big spike in the powerband. This is not only dangerous, but makes the car harder to drive on the track. Hit the turbo switchover point mid-turn and it could send you off the track. What it all comes down to is what you want to do with the car and personal preferance.

i am in 3rd plenty of times at low rpm, when i just want to slightly accelerate, the car moves easy,

with a single turbo there is NOthing down there, u ALWAYS have to downshit, its kidna a pain.

yes that is true that twins dont liek high boost and high power, but the spike is not gonan kill u

unless u are WOT in mid corner and who does that?

they made the sequential setup to have a linear power band and power everywhere not just passed 4k rpm.

vosko 06-06-2003 02:41 PM

my car moves when not on boost its just slow like my blazer https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...IR#>/smile.png

TYSON 06-06-2003 02:41 PM

I think the point is that the sequential turbos do not have a linear power band. Here's 3 guys boosting 15 lbs. Dyno Comparison



On a track you drive out of the corner under power. While a laggy turbo that comes on hard all at once will cause a problem, so will one that jumps around like the stockers on that graph.



Low end power is hard to compare on dyno charts. If the guy driving the car starts from different RPM for different cars the low end won't be comparable. If they ALWAYS got on the throttle hard at 2000 RPM it might help.

j9fd3s 06-06-2003 04:15 PM

you shouldnt be on the gas coming out of a corner unless your past the apex and the steering wheel is going back to straight ahead.



mike

kahren 06-12-2003 01:50 AM


Originally Posted by TYSON' date='Jun 6 2003, 02:41 PM
I think the point is that the sequential turbos do not have a linear power band. Here's 3 guys boosting 15 lbs. Dyno Comparison



On a track you drive out of the corner under power. While a laggy turbo that comes on hard all at once will cause a problem, so will one that jumps around like the stockers on that graph.



Low end power is hard to compare on dyno charts. If the guy driving the car starts from different RPM for different cars the low end won't be comparable. If they ALWAYS got on the throttle hard at 2000 RPM it might help.

the sequential system is VERY LINEAR, SINGLE ISNT

gotta go back to teh drawign board...



stock sequentilal system should be of no problem on teh track unless

u donno how to drive, part throttle doesnt affect the transition, and if u are full thrtolle in mid corner u are not doing somethign right.

Fd3BOOST 06-20-2003 11:48 PM

Late to this thread fellas,

Im curious, whats the cost of the GT35/40 kit and where is the best place to track one down?

rfreeman27 06-21-2003 12:34 AM

rotoryman88 sells them,



heres a link.





He's in the Fredericksburg VA area so hes pretty close to home. https://www.nopistons.com/forums/pub...#>/biggrin.png

93FDGT3540 06-21-2003 01:20 PM


Originally Posted by kahren' date='Jun 11 2003, 10:50 PM
[quote name='TYSON' date='Jun 6 2003, 02:41 PM'] I think the point is that the sequential turbos do not have a linear power band. Here's 3 guys boosting 15 lbs. Dyno Comparison



On a track you drive out of the corner under power. While a laggy turbo that comes on hard all at once will cause a problem, so will one that jumps around like the stockers on that graph.



Low end power is hard to compare on dyno charts. If the guy driving the car starts from different RPM for different cars the low end won't be comparable. If they ALWAYS got on the throttle hard at 2000 RPM it might help.

the sequential system is VERY LINEAR, SINGLE ISNT

gotta go back to teh drawign board...



stock sequentilal system should be of no problem on teh track unless

u donno how to drive, part throttle doesnt affect the transition, and if u are full thrtolle in mid corner u are not doing somethign right. [/quote]

Wow, you really love those twins. You might want to look at the other Forum and count how many posts pertain to boost problems. Probably more than any other issue. You might want to ride in some cars with single turbos. The stock twins have no many issues i cant even decide where to start. other than control issues which are a huge problem, The turbos themselves make so much heat at other than stock boost levels they are engine killers. Also dont forget how nice they crack. Most sets i have seen. Even low mile examples all cracked up. As far as driving goes, when most people race they keep the rpms up and the power is linier at higher rpms. If your still driving around a race track at 2k rpms. ( I still cant understand this argument) then you might have some kind of issue.


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