How Do You Get Some Revvs Out Of A Rotary.
#31
Give the guy a break.
He is obviously new to rotaries
If he says he can make a gasket kit, who is to stop him, we can only try cant we?
I would welcome the offer to buy them less then what the current price is so long as the quality is the same, if not better.
Just to clarify, if you want high RPM, the turbo motors (from factory or off the shelf aftermarket turbo’s) are not designed for that. In fact they were designed to get the same power as a peripheral port would- but WITHOUT the rev's.
If you want a Naturally Aspirated engine to rev that hard AND produce power- PP is the only way to go. From what I gather, PP engines were never really popular in the US. The engines never really lasted due to the water jackets being sealed with devcon, the seals of a high wear component and the higher RPM generally wearing components radically quicker then "normal"
This is why mazda started turbo charging.
To get a turbo rotary to Rev that high, you would need the largest of ports and turbo/s. This would result in strain on the engine and wanting to twist- needing dowelling.
Basically think to your self "what would a big block flow" in air, fuel and exhaust gasses, use the same theory in letting a big block breath and go up a couple of sizes, sometimes double.
EG, Big block exhaust, duel 3''
High RPM Turbo rotor, Go Duel 3.5'' (even in a single turbo)
750 CFM Intake, pretty much double that if you want boost and high rev's
You CAN use standard internals BUT it will not make as much power, rev as fast, sustain a comparable RPM (to one with correct seals) and will require frequent rebuilds. Don’t run carbon seals as they will get hot and act as a glow plug.
The turbine would need an exducer of atleast 3'' with a clipped wheel. You would have to speak to a manufacturer to get something as it won’t be "off the shelf". Be prepared for excessive lag (i.e. 8K RPM on a 13B). Something that spools up at a streetable RPM will not flow enough exhaust gas to allow that sort of RPM. But be prepared as it would rev like a formula 1 car most likely with wheel spin throughout each gear.
Running 5:1 Diff ratios will reduce load on the engine letting it rev higher at a more useable speed
If you are as savage as you say you are at the track, I would assume you will go through gearboxes and diffs, half shafts. A turbo charged engine that still makes power at 12K rpm and is often rev'd to 14K will more then likely be frightening in a 1000 Kg (2000 Lb car)
My only suggestion is don’t use a guru dog box. The guy who makes it couldn’t engineer something if a book fell on his head open at the right page.
My impression as a track car, a turbo charged 13B that revs that high will result in wheel spin in all of your forward gears when in "power band" and more time would be spent trying to keep it straight, let alone track duties in it. It would take 1000’s of $$ and map hours to get it to drive like a properly prepared track car.
Basically, think of the 80’s where formula 1 cars were running turbo’s and CART’s these days. Put your self in their shoes and think as they would think. If you get an Air cooled VW engine to rev to 9000 reliably, and you are not just some shuck with a fat wallet, you will be able to achieve what your goals are.
For this reason you would find that an old school (in Australia) built bridge port or peripheral port engine would be the way to go as it would be linear, tractable, rev like you are led to expect and be generally cheaper in running competitively. You would have more fun racing then what you would with something that seems you are for ever chasing your tail with.
Speed does cost money, but if you are in the business, have enough initiative, and big enough *****, it will be cheaper then just ordering parts.
If you need any further info, please feel free to email me
He is obviously new to rotaries
If he says he can make a gasket kit, who is to stop him, we can only try cant we?
I would welcome the offer to buy them less then what the current price is so long as the quality is the same, if not better.
Just to clarify, if you want high RPM, the turbo motors (from factory or off the shelf aftermarket turbo’s) are not designed for that. In fact they were designed to get the same power as a peripheral port would- but WITHOUT the rev's.
If you want a Naturally Aspirated engine to rev that hard AND produce power- PP is the only way to go. From what I gather, PP engines were never really popular in the US. The engines never really lasted due to the water jackets being sealed with devcon, the seals of a high wear component and the higher RPM generally wearing components radically quicker then "normal"
This is why mazda started turbo charging.
To get a turbo rotary to Rev that high, you would need the largest of ports and turbo/s. This would result in strain on the engine and wanting to twist- needing dowelling.
Basically think to your self "what would a big block flow" in air, fuel and exhaust gasses, use the same theory in letting a big block breath and go up a couple of sizes, sometimes double.
EG, Big block exhaust, duel 3''
High RPM Turbo rotor, Go Duel 3.5'' (even in a single turbo)
750 CFM Intake, pretty much double that if you want boost and high rev's
You CAN use standard internals BUT it will not make as much power, rev as fast, sustain a comparable RPM (to one with correct seals) and will require frequent rebuilds. Don’t run carbon seals as they will get hot and act as a glow plug.
The turbine would need an exducer of atleast 3'' with a clipped wheel. You would have to speak to a manufacturer to get something as it won’t be "off the shelf". Be prepared for excessive lag (i.e. 8K RPM on a 13B). Something that spools up at a streetable RPM will not flow enough exhaust gas to allow that sort of RPM. But be prepared as it would rev like a formula 1 car most likely with wheel spin throughout each gear.
Running 5:1 Diff ratios will reduce load on the engine letting it rev higher at a more useable speed
If you are as savage as you say you are at the track, I would assume you will go through gearboxes and diffs, half shafts. A turbo charged engine that still makes power at 12K rpm and is often rev'd to 14K will more then likely be frightening in a 1000 Kg (2000 Lb car)
My only suggestion is don’t use a guru dog box. The guy who makes it couldn’t engineer something if a book fell on his head open at the right page.
My impression as a track car, a turbo charged 13B that revs that high will result in wheel spin in all of your forward gears when in "power band" and more time would be spent trying to keep it straight, let alone track duties in it. It would take 1000’s of $$ and map hours to get it to drive like a properly prepared track car.
Basically, think of the 80’s where formula 1 cars were running turbo’s and CART’s these days. Put your self in their shoes and think as they would think. If you get an Air cooled VW engine to rev to 9000 reliably, and you are not just some shuck with a fat wallet, you will be able to achieve what your goals are.
For this reason you would find that an old school (in Australia) built bridge port or peripheral port engine would be the way to go as it would be linear, tractable, rev like you are led to expect and be generally cheaper in running competitively. You would have more fun racing then what you would with something that seems you are for ever chasing your tail with.
Speed does cost money, but if you are in the business, have enough initiative, and big enough *****, it will be cheaper then just ordering parts.
If you need any further info, please feel free to email me
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12-18-2003 03:47 PM
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